• brigid's Avatar

    brigid

    Otaku Legend | Posted 11/20/09 | Reply

    @AP Ichigo:

    Ah. I see. Man, poor guy enjoys some Japanese cooking and passes out while purging himself on his host. Kinda feel sorry for everyone involved.

  • cougarsama's Avatar

    cougarsama

    LDS Fangirl! (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/20/09 | Reply

    Yes, people, thank you for the correction. My point was that bowing out of respect is far and away above bowing because you're going to be sick on someone. And didn't Bush Jr. have an 'off-mic' moment at some summit a couple years ago where he utterly flamed some other leader with some ill-chosen language? Obama is losing his grip on the rule of this country, but he behaves well enough in public.

  • AP Ichigo's Avatar

    AP Ichigo

    Japan Bureau (Podcasters) | Posted 11/19/09 | Reply

    @brigid:

    It was the prime minister, Kiichi Miyazawa, and yes it happened. 1992 was a fun year in politics. Google it for videos.

    Thanks,

    Ichigo

  • AP Ichigo's Avatar

    AP Ichigo

    Japan Bureau (Podcasters) | Posted 11/19/09 | Reply

    @cougarsama:

    Actually, it was three presidents ago, Bush Sr. not Dubya. :-)

    Thanks,

    Ichigo

  • SomeGuy's Avatar

    SomeGuy

    Canadian Liaison (Team) | Posted 11/19/09 | Reply

    @Ace:

    I need to see this episode, clearly . . . sounds like a good one.

  • SunfallE's Avatar

    SunfallE

    Nyaa~ (ZE MEANIE) | Posted 11/19/09 | Reply

    @Ace:

    Shhhh Ace. That's supposed to be a secret. ._.


    In the name of the tune I will punish you!

  • Ace's Avatar

    Ace

    Senile Hipster (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/19/09 | Reply

    @KeenHavoc:

    Clearly, President Obama wants to Kill Smurfs.

  • brigid's Avatar

    brigid

    Otaku Legend | Posted 11/19/09 | Reply

    @Indi:

    Definitely. I mean, I didn't vote for him but I really don't think too ill of him. He's doing a pretty good job, I think, even though he's not the guy I wanted in office.

    Oh, and on the comment someone made about Bush Sr. throwing up on the emperor: That hardly seems like a point of comparison. For one thing, there seems to be some disagreement as to whether he threw up on the emperor or the prime minister. This makes me wonder just a bit if the event actually took place.

  • brigid's Avatar

    brigid

    Otaku Legend | Posted 11/19/09 | Reply

    @AP Ichigo:

    "It doesn't matter whether they're in Japan, the US or an unclaimed area of Antartica, two world leaders are equal and should act like it."

    Quoted for truth.

    Of course, when in doubt, bow a little lower. To me it seems better to err on the side of caution.

  • KeenHavoc's Avatar

    KeenHavoc

    Grand Otaku | Posted 11/19/09 | Reply

    I want to ask if President Obama bowed out of respect for the individual and their position as Emperor of a nation or for the cultural "guest and host" nature of the meeting. For example if the Emperor or other royalty were a guest meeting Obama for lunch in the White House, would Obama still have bowed to him out of respect of the crown?

    And yes political pundits are jerks, at least the successful ones are(Did anyone catch last week's South Park with Cartman and the radio show? It pretty much summed up Fox News and it's fanatics case and point).


    Last edited by KeenHavoc at 6:46:35 PM EST on November 19, 2009.

  • Keiyou's Avatar

    Keiyou

    Otakuite+ | Posted 11/19/09 | Reply

    Yeesh. Polititions need to lighten up, I don't see what Obama was doing wrong. When in Rome, do as the Romans do, no?
    Okay, so I keep hearing he didn't exactly bow quite right, but I agree with Cougarsama, it is a step up, at least Obama's trying to be friendly.

  • cougarsama's Avatar

    cougarsama

    LDS Fangirl! (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/18/09 | Reply

    Seeing as how our last president threw up on the Japanese leader at a political function, we can clearly only move up from there.

  • KCHuang's Avatar

    KCHuang

    Senior Otaku+ | Posted 11/18/09 | Reply

    @Indi:

    I realize that. When I said "Americans are idiots," I meant myself included. :D

  • Indi's Avatar

    Indi

    Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/18/09 | Reply

    For all you silly n00blets getting off on the tangent of stupid Americans, they need to remember that they’re not God, among other sweeping generalizations that just make you look ignorant yourself… You’re also forgetting that the article is talking about “critics” of Obama. Not “ALL” Americans.

    He’s President of the US, because more than 50% of us voted him into office. So including us in those “sweeping generalizations” is pretty dumb. We helped put him in office to begin with. And guess what? Most of us are fine with the gesture too. Sure he might have messed it up a bit, but the effort is what matters.

    ~Crystia

  • Indi's Avatar

    Indi

    Dr. Mama Cat. (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/18/09 | Reply

    @KCHuang:

    People who issue blanket generalizations are idiots. You’d do well to remember that.

    ~Crystia

  • KCHuang's Avatar

    KCHuang

    Senior Otaku+ | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    Americans are idiots. Politicians are idiots. American politicians are off the scale.

    Props to Obama for at least attempting to respect Japan's culture.


    Last edited by KCHuang at 11:46:18 PM EST on November 17, 2009.

  • Creme Of Rolo's Avatar

    Creme Of Rolo

    Senior Otaku+ | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @AP Ichigo:

    I agree. A nod of the head would have been acceptable.

  • Creme Of Rolo's Avatar

    Creme Of Rolo

    Senior Otaku+ | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    To lung into this conversation;

    The reason people are upset at the fact that The President bowed is because America was founded under God. We have tried to never bow to show that the only King we bow to is God, and that is who America was founded to serve under. That is why in our pledge it says "One Nation, Under God." So I see where people are coming from.

    Yet at the same time I also think that it is rude not to bow in a country where bowing is customary. So really the whole situation is pretty messed up.

    May I point the question out; To bow or not to bow.

    But coming to my final conclusion is that if Obama wants to show that America is still a Christian Nation, it is best that he had shaken the Emperors hand. For Christians and soldiers of God, even if other disagree, we must stand up for out King and God.

    So in a way I can see both points. Above was just my oppression.

  • AP Ichigo's Avatar

    AP Ichigo

    Japan Bureau (Podcasters) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @SomeGuy:

    Exactly. I think he should have bowed. But the bow should have been that accorded an equal, which is a nod of the head, not a bow from the waist. It doesn't matter whether they're in Japan, the US or an unclaimed area of Antartica, two world leaders are equal and should act like it. The bow Obama did was that of a mailroom boy to the President of Toyota. Plus the whole mixing with the handshake thing. Do them both if you want, but do them separately. That's common here between Japanese and foreign businessmen, a quick head nod bow and then a handshake. I see the issue less as "OMG OBAMA PROSTRATED HIMSELF BEFORE JAPAN" as "huh, he obviously got bad information and/or decided to ad-lib, poorly".

    Thanks,

    Ichigo


    Last edited by animepulse at 9:27:13 PM EST on November 17, 2009.

  • Nehszriah's Avatar

    Nehszriah

    Hits Self With Axe (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @:

    Just try to be a little more objective next time, 'kay? Irritated is one thing, but dragging around a bunch of people in the mud for little to no reason is a whole other story. There's a reason adults can still fight like children. *shrugs*


    Be true, be you and of course, be otaku.

  • wuzzle320's Avatar

    wuzzle320

    Otaku Eternal | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @Ace:

    I agree on the idea of mutual respect. What I disagree with is our leaders saying that Obama should not have bowed to the Emp. My view is thus: when you are in someone else's house, you play by their rules. Aka, respect their customes. Americans (as a whole) tend to inflate the importance of our leaders vs. those of other countries.


    Laugh Often

  • Kaiz Dark Angel05's Avatar

    Kaiz Dark Angel05

    Otaku Legend | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    When I first read this on Yahoo news, I -really- wanted to leave a flame comment. My main issue was not that the people were yelling at him for bowing, but because neither the author nor any of the people mentioned or quoted in the article stated the fact that it's part of the culture of Japan to bow to those who you respect. In all actuality, I would rather him show a sign of respect and us still be political friends with Japan, as opposed to his ignoring their customs and possibly setting off a feud. But obviously the people flaming Obama are ignorant of Japanese culture. Feh.

  • Ace's Avatar

    Ace

    Senile Hipster (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @wuzzle320:

    Of course America doesn't control the world, but neither does Japan. World leaders should be treating each other with mutual respect no matter where they are, not treating the other as inferior when they're visiting the country. Leaders looking down on their equals is a recipe for bad foreign policy and generally just not a very good way to treat a guest.

    Not that I think the Emperor was regarding Obama as inferior. The way I read the situation, Obama was respecting the Emperor in the manner best recognized by the local culture (and admittedly botching it a little,) and the Emperor accepted the gesture with no indication of condescension. If it was wrong of him not to bow back, I think he can be forgiven because as the Emperor, he would be used to being bowed to frequently without bowing back. It's just something he hasn't become accustomed to.

  • Waffuru's Avatar

    Waffuru

    Otaku Ranter (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    You would think that living in the day and age that we do people would be better informed on other cultures. Obviously not. Well... unless your the President of the United States or people lurking about on theOtaku.

  • wuzzle320's Avatar

    wuzzle320

    Otaku Eternal | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @Shinmaru:

    I will join, I will join!!! High Fives all around!!


    Laugh Often

  • lazyweird1's Avatar

    lazyweird1

    Grand Otaku | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @Shinmaru:

    HIGH FIVE X INFINITY!!!!

    How do I get that many hands...? o_o; *ponders*

  • wuzzle320's Avatar

    wuzzle320

    Otaku Eternal | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @:

    AGREE! I am an American, and respect our president, but that's just it. He is the president of AMERICA. Even if the two are on the 'same level', Obama was in JAPAN at the time. Lest we for foget that the US doesn't control the world?


    Laugh Often

  • sunachick's Avatar

    sunachick

    Grand Otaku | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    The heck? What's wrong with those people? Obama was simply respecting another culture's customs. Wouldn't you expect the emperor of Japan to greet our president with a handshake? And what happened to the 'racial tolerance' that America's so famous for?
    I apologize for my rantiness, but those people are crazy AND stupid.

  • SpiffySporkPerson's Avatar

    SpiffySporkPerson

    Otaku Eternal | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    In the clip I originally saw on the news, there was no bow, only a handshake, and I was wondering why he DIDN'T bow. You should should follow the customs of another culture when you're in their country.

    ALSO. Shouldn't the president have people to tell him how to do this stuff right?

  • EbonyFox's Avatar

    EbonyFox

    Otakuite | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    I must say that I REALLY enjoyed reading these comments, they really are fascinating :-]

  • EbonyFox's Avatar

    EbonyFox

    Otakuite | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @Shadweh:

    I Applaud your statement!

  • Nehszriah's Avatar

    Nehszriah

    Hits Self With Axe (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @:

    Back home, (I'm from Detroit) it can be considered an insult to buy a foreign-made car. Said cars have been our regional life-support for decades and has become part of our culture and lifeblood. When some uppity jerk comes around thinking that his car is superior simply because it wasn't touched by his blue-collar neighbors, problems start. Different cars fit different people for different reasons, just like how different cultures vary from person to person due to a variety of circumstances. I'm appalled at how many people just don't understand how important cars are to my local economy just because other industries decided they wanted to skip over Detroit and go where they live instead. Then again, a lot of these industries probably thought all we were capable of doing was making cars and attending sporting events and were just unaware that the fact we became such an automotive hub was to save the consumer money by keeping all the materials in a centralized location to cut down on unnecessary shipping costs for parts. I can tell you for a fact that they are wrong about us, as we were never given the chance and can achieve great things as long as we have the opportunities that before turned up their noses and moved along.

    If you don't understand part of someone else's culture, it's not because you're an idiot jerk but because you're uninformed. Many perfectly, rational, intelligent people can be uninformed about culture tidbits like Detroit's cars or Japan's bowing and not mean anything negative by it. Simply not knowing isn't a crime. Potential social gaffe? Maybe. Proof that all Americans are incapable of speaking without making total fools out of themselves? No.

    For the record, I don't think I know a single American who truly believes in that 2012 nonsense or believed in Y2k... so please stop declaring to the world that we do. It's incredibly rude to assume like that.


    Be true, be you and of course, be otaku.

  • Shadweh's Avatar

    Shadweh

    Otaku Eternal | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    Considering that the paper I just wrote takes place in the Age of Imperialism, the gesture of respect Obama did is a big leap for America (even if he is definitely not the first to do this). I will say this though: I personally think that he should have done a little more homework on Japanese courtesy before bowing as low as he did. Then again, he probably got the research from one of his aids and misinterpreted it for all I know...

  • TimeChaser's Avatar

    TimeChaser

    Madman With a Box (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @Shinmaru:

    *HIGH FIVES* :D


    Bazinga!

  • TimeChaser's Avatar

    TimeChaser

    Madman With a Box (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @:

    At least he didn't jump up on the cutting board like Bobby Flay did at the end of his first match in the original Iron Chef. That received quite a bit of ire.


    Bazinga!

  • SomeGuy's Avatar

    SomeGuy

    Canadian Liaison (Team) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @AP Ichigo:

    The guy I got this news from mentioned that Obama bowed too low as well, yeah.

    So from your take, you'd see this as less of "he screwed up, but at least he tried" to more of "he did not do the research"?

  • Shinmaru's Avatar

    Shinmaru

    Baron of Terribad (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    This whole problem would be eliminated if everyone adopted the high five as their official greeting. Who doesn't feel awesome after getting a high five? And there's no ambiguity about it either. Join me in high fiving our way to the top of the world.


    Love thy Evangelion.

  • kittens 3's Avatar

    kittens 3

    The Stalker (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    I dont think anyone should really be making a big deal out of this. When in a forgien country, do as they do. Its not too complicated. Granted, he did bow a little low, but still.

    Anyway, in America, with all the other problems we're having, shouldn't we pay a little less attention to this? I mean, all this publicity for what would equal.. a handshake in this country perhaps, its just... Yeah. :/

  • TimeChaser's Avatar

    TimeChaser

    Madman With a Box (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @:

    Please, I am just as sickened by people believing in the whole 2012 thing. Do not include me with the idiots. Thank you.


    Bazinga!

  • Shinmaru's Avatar

    Shinmaru

    Baron of Terribad (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @:

    Sorry, me calling out your completely generalized opinion is totally and utterly uncalled for. I'll go back to my dark, evil hole now -- got to get ready for my lunch meeting with Big Brother and Stalin. I'll never infringe upon your right to free speech by challenging your opinion ever again. I swear.


    Love thy Evangelion.

  • Ace's Avatar

    Ace

    Senile Hipster (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @:

    Don't go bashing America and then whining about being denied Freedom of Speech, now. That's part of our constitution, after all. :p

  • Ace's Avatar

    Ace

    Senile Hipster (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @:

    Are you really doing this again? You just insulted an entire country based entirely on the unfounded superstitions of some of our more vocal minorities. That's hardly fair at all. I'm curious as to how you would feel if I told you all Japanese people were bigots because of the abundance of Blackface characters in manga and anime. You're going to have to learn how to participate in a discussion without blatantly insulting everyone who disagrees with you every time you post, because it really doesn't win you any points, yo.

    In any case, and this goes for everyone, the America-bashing is getting old, guys. I happen to live in America and think it's a pretty cool place. So a couple of outspoken political bigwigs misinterpreted a gesture. It's not like you're required to have intricate knowledge of the workings of Irish Monarchy to hold office in the US. Ease up.

  • DemonKingAtticus's Avatar

    DemonKingAtticus

    A Fiery Spirit (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    This would actually be a good research topic. This has happened before when Obama went to Saudi Arabia, if I recall correctly, and bowed to their royalty and even then there was an outrage.

    "Obama is making America look weak!"
    "It's against protocol!"
    "It's the end of days!" (well, maybe not this one)

    However, I'd like to look up in a newspaper archive on how people responded when President Nixon shook the hands of communist leaders in China. If there was a public outrage by Democrats, perhaps we have simply nothing more than the same old song but to a different tune. If not, it could either illustrate the way our news or our culture has changed within the span of several decades!

  • Shinmaru's Avatar

    Shinmaru

    Baron of Terribad (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @:

    Well, let's not get overzealous here and start making generalizations. That's every bit as silly and ignorant as what's happening in that story.


    Love thy Evangelion.

  • scribblezfox's Avatar

    scribblezfox

    Otakuite+ | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    Wow... Just wow...

  • brigid's Avatar

    brigid

    Otaku Legend | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    When in Rome and all that. Sheesh.

    Then again, which World War was it during which our president refused to negotiate with a national leader who wasn't democratically elected? Granted Mr. Obama probably bowed wrong, granted the people complaining are culturally ignorant morons. There are worse things.

  • ChibiHanyou's Avatar

    ChibiHanyou

    Ochibi~ (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    Well now we know the other politicians have no respect for other people and their culture. They're always thinking about themselves. At least the president knew the formal way to greet them. Good for him.

  • Nehszriah's Avatar

    Nehszriah

    Hits Self With Axe (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    Why do I find it funny that a Canadian's posting this? :D

    Still, I think we, on this site, are more than a bit biased about this news nugget. Many of us anime nerds who come from Western backgrounds have already ingrained this kind of stuff into our brains. Other people, like the normies making a fuss, don't necessarily understand the customs and traditions of other lands in full since they have never required such information. When in Japan, you respect Japanese ways. When in Britain, you respect British ways. When in Egypt, you respect Egyptian ways. If people don't need to go to or deal with people/things from Japan, Britain or Egypt, they might not always recall the different cultural nuances. It's not so much that Americans are being dumb here, but they were unfamiliar with the situation and experienced culture shock. Trust me; it happens.


    Be true, be you and of course, be otaku.

  • 7thEvaChild's Avatar

    7thEvaChild

    Spectre Knight (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    seriously..... dang whats wrong with that..... come on, politicians, swallow the dang pride and try not to choke on it.....

  • Air-Dragon's Avatar

    Air-Dragon

    Otaku Eternal | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @Art Munkee:

    Thank you people! American but i dont see it as a big deal. lol Sometimes i think its about time~

  • Art Munkee's Avatar

    Art Munkee

    Saskies (Otakuite++) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    Oh America, how you amuse me. This isn't a very big deal, the President was just trying to show some respect, so that's what should count. Gosh people are so silly =.="

  • touketsusharingan's Avatar

    touketsusharingan

    LEGEND (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @wolf of sorrow:

    totally agreed ._.

  • wolf of sorrow's Avatar

    wolf of sorrow

    JMusicGuru (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    Even if he did bow wrong or whatever, he did try to show respect to their culture, which is very cool in my opinion. :]

  • TimeChaser's Avatar

    TimeChaser

    Madman With a Box (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    People will find the smallest things to complain about. >>;


    Bazinga!

  • wallpaperotaku's Avatar

    wallpaperotaku

    The Hero of Time (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    Hm, did the emperor return the bow? I think the bow is fine as long as equal respect is shown in return (though I found the bow to be VERY low?)

  • AP Ichigo's Avatar

    AP Ichigo

    Japan Bureau (Podcasters) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    My particular problem is that the Emperor doesn't bow to anyone, ever. He might nod his head to a fellow leader, which is what Obama should have done. What Japanese don't do is mix a handshake with a bow. You do one or the other. And the bow that Obama did do was a bow that people far lower on the social scale do to those far higher. If he was going to bow he should have done a very slight head bow and not shaken hands. If he was going to shake hands he shouldn't have bowed. As it is he ended up looking like an ass with a karate-kid level of Japanese cultural knowledge to both countries.

    Thanks,

    Ichigo


    Last edited by animepulse at 10:00:49 AM EST on November 17, 2009.

  • SaigasEye's Avatar

    SaigasEye

    Otakuite | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    Did the President make sure to hold for 3 secs? Did he make sure to present his business card face up in the palm of both hands? Did he shake his hand while bowing? Did the emperor return the bow? These are questions America needs to be asking...

  • 64oldman's Avatar

    64oldman

    Otakuite+ | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    America: The land of the dumb and the home of the ignorant!

  • kugen's Avatar

    kugen

    Grand Otaku | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    American leaders are so full of foolishness. Our president showed respect to another culture, and the politicians over here are whining? America is not the leader of the universe.

    ~kugen

  • jannycats's Avatar

    jannycats

    Otaku Legend | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    I love the US, I really do, but it's so obnoxious when some people think that they're the king of the world just because they live there.

    I totally agree with Miss Anonymous, *facepalm* indeed...

  • AyaKagami's Avatar

    AyaKagami

    Otakuite | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    Personally, I think the Prez did the right thing by bowing. America isn't God so they need to get the God-complex feeling out of their system. Second, the President was showing his respect for the foreign leader, after all he is the emperor.

    Anyways, as an american, I think he was just being culturally correct. American analyst on the other hand are too anal to see respect for culture and think it's dissing the country.

    Stupid Americans.

  • Miss Anonymous's Avatar

    Miss Anonymous

    Vagrant AI (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @Ace:

    There is nothing wrong with your logic there. Nope, none at all.

  • Ace's Avatar

    Ace

    Senile Hipster (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    @Miss Anonymous:

    How dare he greet people in the local culture's accepted method of exhibiting mutual respect! You totally should have punched him for us, Missy. He's a traitor to America.

  • Shinmaru's Avatar

    Shinmaru

    Baron of Terribad (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    Ah, they're just miffed because he didn't bow to whitey when he came back home.


    Love thy Evangelion.

  • Miss Anonymous's Avatar

    Miss Anonymous

    Vagrant AI (Otaku Eternal) | Posted 11/17/09 | Reply

    *facepalm* @ the stupid people